It'll never happen Pat. You'll never get them to admit the elephant is in the room, let alone debate you on it. Just like the gangs of 12 year olds on dirt bikes terrorizing the city streets and the police aren't even allowed to pursue them. They want you to come into the city and spend your money, but won't do ANYTHING about the gangs of animals that rob and beat you up when you try to do so. I used to love going downtown. But I don't feel like putting my life or my family's lives at stake anymore. Let the animals that are causing the problems use their money to keep the city's tax coffers full. Maybe when someone in the Mayors family is assaulted or killed, something may be done about it.

Pat, why not put your money where your mouth is and move into Baltimore City and run for mayor? You may get a debate then. You might even get a few people to listen to you.

Sean, he was born in Baltimore City and went to Baltimore City College and the University of Baltimore.

It made national news on the HuffPost with 130.000 - likes - on Facebook. It was also featured in the Baltimore Sun and drew 10,000 views on the Sun's Talk Board.

The city's last voter turnout was 14%. A disgrace by any standard. Baltimore is in the top ten of - most dangerous cities.

Sounds like a good time for some kind of debate, don't you think?

Buzz, I think its a great topic for debate, and I think discussing the racial aspect is fair game. A lot of law-abiding black folks in Baltimore are outraged at these young thugs..... BUT ... One miniute McDonough is claiming that it was impoirtant for him to explicity mention the race of the combatants, the next minute (and I heard him discuss this on WBAL radio Saturday morning May 19) he claims that too kuch is being made of the "black youth" angle and not enough attention was being paid to trhe crime angle. Later, on his own show on WCBM,he was back defiantly insisting that the race is a big deal. So which is it? And what about the mobs of racially-mixed alcohol-fueld college kids and older who roamed Canton on St.Patrick's Day. They also have been large group problems at times in South Baltimore and Fells Point. Important for discussion,but not McDonough's focus for some reason. Also, if his release had simply challenged the mayor about young mobs running amok in various parts of Baltimore without using the word "black" do you think it would have made the blow-hard Huffington Post?

Edward V tindel
1:36 am on Wednesday, May 30, 2012
its been at least 7 days now,how come the Baltimore city police department,the mayor,and the police commissioner have not shown the 7-Eleven black flash mob video tape..you know why ,because it shows black kids robbing the store.more proff that McDonough is right
.http://innerharborviolencenightmaresonlightstreet.renthandy.com/

its "pay back" time if youre white you wont get listened to

I think my point was missed. I totally agree that McDonough has the right to chime in on Baltimore City politics and social issues as the citizens of Maryland do pony up a lot of cash for our beleaguered city. I think my point was McDonough shouldn't expect Rawlings-Blake to accept his offer to a debate since, as far as she is concerned, there is nothing to debate. What could she possibly achieve by arguing a non-issue ("black youth mobs") with the Delegate? If McDonough wants to press the issue, he'll have apply real pressure to Rawlings-Blake, and the only way I can see that happening is if he runs against her.

Black youth mobs, is a non-issue. Unbelieveable!

I was told that Bealefeld is retiring to get a job at Johns Hopkins, so his daughter? geta a free education. Take it would what it's worth.

My relative works at JHU and the family member benefit for college is 1/2 of the JHU tuition to any college of their choice. Still it is a good benefit and he doesn't have to deal with the stream of murders in Baltimore City. Good for Bealefeld.

I totally agree something needs to done about the gangs, not just in the "City" but "Statewide". This is not just BLACK KIDS in GANGS but ALL RACES joining GANGS. Terrorising neighborhoods. Let's not just worry about the GANG activity at the INNER HARBOR but EVERYWHERE !!!!!!!! Now it's a problem because we wanna protect TOURIST !!!! What about Communities who deal with it everyday McDonough !!!!!!! Anthony Cole

I believe that Blake is probably afraid that the debate will be masterfully baited...don't think she has the confidence to deal with it...

That's why the Carry Law is needed in Maryland. The scum know nothing will happen to them.

All of the above "sparring" could have been eliminated if people would stop and think before they put their hand to the keyboard!

TIme for a real national conversation on the ongoing failure of the inner city culture. The culture produces more children having children, deadbeat dads, high drop out rates, crime, lack of work ethic, and more social problems with each generation. Where are the leaders in this city?

And this story appears in the "Bel Air Patch" because..........?

I agree 100% with the Delegate!
A debate will never happen, the Delegate is aware of this. The purpose of bringing it up is to force this hot topic to be addressed by the Mayor. Every Mayor the city has ever had has been excellent on letting things slide under the rug by ignoring the topic and reversing the situation. Mayor Rawlings-Blake is not addressing the issue on purpose (as I am sure her cabinet is telling her to do).
I am promising major distractions (the Baltimore Grand Prix, the 200th Anniversary of 1812) will be high on the Mayor's agenda to discuss repeatedly in the coming days to detract from the topic of "Black Youth Mobs". Its politics as usual.

Looks like McDonough isn't content to merely talk like Boss Hogg, he wants to dress like him too.

I will gladly debate Del. McDonough about this issue. I am both a constituent of his, and I spent almost every day in the Inner Harbor and Eastern Baltimore City last year, and his comments have been hyperbole to bolster his name during the election season.

This is what he does- come those most special Novembers, he brings up race or nationalism and exploits it. Anyone wishing to look up his voting record will see how worthless he is as a politician( not because he's a Republican, but simply a worthless mass).

And Tim, you seem to favor Conservative values; may I suggest you focus on U.S. History for a bit so to educate yourself when it comes to inner-city cultures. Maybe throw in a bit of Sociology and Anthropology. You ramble and rant, attack others for the very things you, yourself, commit, and you do nothing to back up your claims.

Honestly, Darth Tim, your arguments are already dull and tired. Bring some facts to the table and let's start an actual conversation.

Thankfully, the Mayor doesn't take this Clown seriously.

Pandering??? What in the Heck do you think McDonough is doing?

this is why where u are watching an oriole game the stadium looks empty after the 7th inning. people donot what to put up with the kids downtown or the homelessw people bothering them. i had a kid try and rob me leaveing the stadium last year when i diffended myself the police wanted to lock me up instead. thank god for video cameras.

I stand with Del. McDonough. How refreshing that we have an elected official who is not afraid state the obvious. The rest all hide behind political correctness while Rome burns!

Amen Scott!!!!

Pat McDonough is right. The city that bleeds and breeds is a violent cesspool. And the politicians think that throwing more money at the animals will cure the problems.

GREAT thread and comments... seriously! I think there's a lot of truth in McD's comments, but for many reasons he is a lousy messenger for such a politically charged topic. Pretending it's not a serious problem, or pointing out other problems as some sort of defense that it's not all that bad, is simply delusional.

Hmmmmm. Let's see....roving bands of black youth terrorizing the city. I think we can all agree this is happening. A story by the Baltimore Sun a few years back on youth gangs in Baltimore highlighted why youth joined gangs. But the real story was what the gang leaders said. And I am paraphrasing here: youth would not join gangs if there were jobs, better education and recreation. It seems the Mayor has not read this report for her administration's support for these areas is flimsy at best. Give HUGH tax breaks to developers and let the rest of us suffer.
I do think we need better policing and wonder why this has not happened. We have the SIXTH largest police force in the country but for a city not even ranked sixth largest in the country. What do they do?

I am white but our race is too passive. Notice whenever a black person is killed or assaulted by whites, the black people protest and march in unison. I feel white people should protest and hold a rally on Baltimore City Hall. White people have been too passive about the robbing, assualting and general crime that they have suffered by black youths. If Delegate Pat McDonough wants to hold a rally or protest, sign me up. White people must stand up and say "we are not going to take it anymore!"

If they don't get crime under control, the only way I will visit the Inner Harbor will be under HB 45. If I can't protect myself and my family, forget EVER visiting Baltimore City in the future.

Rev, Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are fast to step in on any incident that involves the black race.If their influence can only be focused on positive things like holding a rally in Baltimore city to address some of the violence.Why can't they help the Mayor with her problems.Not like it hasn't reached them on the internet. Many good people in Baltimore who can't walk down their streets without fear from violence..People working together is more realistic the trying to fight crime by putting more police on the street.You can see how well it works.Pat just made people aware of a problem downtown that could put them in danger.If it was white mobs it should be reported as such. It wasn't, but that should not be a reflection of the many good black citizens
who "also" want stability in their neighborhoods.Crime trends continue as long as they are not addressed.

The white and black elected public servant leader mobs do far more damage to the city than any group of bored kids ever have.

Ask the federal worker and the BG&E worker beaten & robbed yesterday, how they feel about the mob problem in the city.

Honor student Tiarra Brown was arrested last Thursday at Casa Academy in Southwest Baltimore while practicing in a graduation rehearsal on attempted murder charges by mistake, msnbc.com reports.
She spent four days in central booking, missing her graduation.
what a missed up city,from the mayor to the commissioners office.they can lock up a innocent person for a crime they didn't even know about,yet they can video tape a bunch of black teens robbing and assaulting a store clerk and no one is arrested. i want a new mayor,commissioner,and states attorney.these people are terrible
http://innerharborviolencenightmaresonlightstreet.renthandy.com/

These problems are problems all directly related to abject poverty. The only solution to poverty is effective education. Until we find a way to properly educate those children born into poverty stricken families the problems we have like this will not be solved and any "band aid" will only make the whole thing worse. Some days I think we are so close to a repeat of the race riots of the 50's and 60's only this time it won't be about race. It will be about poverty.

What the delegate is suggesting is not going to work. Youth don't need a choice between a youth entertainment center, or youth jail. What they need is a sense that the future will hold some meaning for them. They need a broader educated world view. If we focused on something that would give them that, then I would have more hope.

A new study came out that said the poverty stricken children benefit from attending a high performing school. It's been a long held belief that a lack of economic diversity in the makeup of our school system is a really big problem however people choose to live where they do for reason that are many times completely valid. I don't know what it's going to take to solve this problem but the Delegates plan isn't going to work. It doesn't educate.

How about a full day head start program?

Lily,
What you’re suggesting is basically a MOVE TO OPPURTUNITY education program. This program did not work well for neighborhoods. When are we going to hold the parents or families liable for the actions of their children? They get sent to school for that education you speak of, but if a parent isn’t there for the child after school what good is the schooling? You also suggest another costly entitlement program of a Head start Program. Where does this money come from? I’m sick of my tax dollars going to failed entitlement programs. The only true way of breaking the cycle is to get these people off of public assistance and get to work. Their children will see you need to work for a better quality of life. They will also see the better education you get the possible more money you can earn. But as long as parents shows their children look what I can get for free, steal or cheat someone out of the cycle will never be broken. It all starts at home with the parents.

I'm not advocating any particular dogma. I'm merely suggesting that we think more deeply about the solutions people propose from a pragmatic perspective so that maybe we can find something that hasn't been tried that has some relationship to the known cause of the problem.

We don't live in a society where we hold people responsible for another person's decisions. Are you suggesting we hold parents criminally liable for children's actions? That could have some really severe unintended consequences.

They get sent to school and somehow still don't receive an education. Going to school is not the same thing as being effectively educated. We already spend money on these same families with thier daycare vouchers. I'm merely suggesting that a program run by a school could be more effective than neighborhood daycares. A lot of research has indicated the effectiveness of early education leading to broader success in elementary school.

40% of Marylander get food stamps or some other type of assistance. Not too many get TCA anymore and if they do it's only about $400 per month. Most can't live on that so they do in fact work. That's part of the problem. These children are unsupervised because their single mother's are working one or two minimum wage jobs just to survive and the state allows anyone from 8 years old up to be legally left alone.

Minimum wage jobs don't lead to a better quality of life than dealing drugs.

The problem is further exacerbated by the fact that people in poverty are highly discriminated against on the bases of a combination of socioeconomic status/race/educational attainment. They have difficulty finding a combination of affordable housing/public transportation/quality schools and low crime areas all in the same place. As a result people in poverty end up living clustered together. Because African Americans are disproportionately affected by poverty these clusters end up being mostly African American although increasingly other races are finding themselves there as well.

We have a big problem that we need to find a way to do something about. I don't know what the solution is. But I bet it has something to do with recognizing that these people are part of our community and we need to stop thinking of them as animals. What happen to love thy neighbor? If we had done that we wouldn't be in this problem to begin with and nothing short of that will solve the problem. The problem is not just going to go away.

Lily, in my mind, the best solution would be jobs for teenagers and their parents. I would gladly pay for training, for low income recipients in a career that would lift them out of poverty. Use our taxpayer dollars for mandatory job training instead of subsidizing a family with free handouts year after year, sometimes for generations! Free handouts such as food stamps, subsidized childcare and housing, free medical and energy assistance only cause people to stay in the same station of life. If you receive any help, there has to be some work performed in exchange. You can't sit at home and expect to be taken care of the rest of your life. As for low income teenagers, I would hope the city and the many businesses would provide summer jobs at minimum wage. There has to be some low level job these teens could perform. The city could start a clean up program on the many vacant trash filled lots and plants trees or flowers. How about a clean up program to clean the trash filled alleys? I know this may sound crazy, but Baltimore City can't continue on the road it is on now. I only wish there was another William Donald Schaefer to run Baltimore City. He was the last best mayor Baltimore City had.

I'm curious, what happens when you have a city with a curfew, high homeless rate, inadequate numbers of shelters to house all the homeless, and "no loitering" laws? Does that mean a person could be criminally charged and put in jail simply for being homeless? If that homeless person happen to have a job as some do, did they just loose it because they got arrested for having no place to go? Sounds like a good way to institutionalize poverty.

That's what I mean by not thinking about public policy in a pragmatic way or as a network of policies. We seem to be only able to consider what we want to happen an not the unintended consequences, particularly when combined with the last thing we tried that didn't work but is still in place.

I have some ideas. How about if individuals volunteer to do things so government doesn't have to. A good place to start would be with CASA (Court apointed special advocates for children). They are always short of volunteers and there are tens of thousands of children in the state of MD that could benefit from a CASA. The question is do we really care or do we just want to lock all these people up and get rid of them?

Lily,
My suggestion would be hold the parents criminally responsible maybe they will open their eyes up or stop having children.

You stated kids going to school and not getting an education, why is that? Is it because the teachers are failing to teach the students? If so FIRE THEM. Pay teachers and administrators per performance and I bet kids will start learning. Or is it the kids don’t give two craps in being there?

If 40% of the state collects some type of entitlement, again why is that? Laziness? The politicians chasing away corporations with high taxes? Or some other reason?

I’m all for getting people off public assistance. Lets say family “A” has been on public assistance for 10 years, first off why? Why haven’t they been sent to a trade school? Let’s say the state finds them a job and they bring home a $1000 dollars a month and they normally receive through entitlements $2000 dollars then the state gives them a check for a $1000 dollars. And this state entitlement drops every time they get a raise until they have equaled out or raised above the amount allotted them each month.

Minimum wage is a start which if you work hard it’s the path to a better life. Not everyone starts out making $60,000 a year

Funny how people like to say that poor city people are suffering badly from lack of "good" education, no places to play basketball, no after school programs, no jobs, no job training.... but boy do they have some nice $200 shoes, $2000 gold chains, diamond earrings, fancy rims, and the newest cell phones out. hummmmm...

My family works hard and always has and we have none of those things. In fact the last time I bought a new pair of shoes they were $30 and the last time I could afford to buy my wife a nice piece of jewelry was 4 years ago, and we both drive fully paid off cars that are 15 years old, can't afford new ones. But boy, "socio-economincally" challenged poor people in the city have all those bling things that my family sure can't afford? Somethings wrong with that picture.

One of my neighbors has rent control in an expensive apartment near me and she has 3 kids... no big deal right? It is what it is and she is a really nice woman and her kids are nice too. BUT, weird how she drives a 2011 Lexus all maxed out, has the brand new iphone which she is always using, and dresses like a goddess. Yet she is on rent control (and yes I know she is on rent control).

just to show you how political this mayor is.how can you have 20 black teens,in there school uniforms in a 7-eleven,some of them assault and steal money from the store.its video taped by two cameras,one inside the store,one outside the store.and yet the district states attorney,mr Bernstein, refuses to prosecute the young black thugs.and these city officials are telling people its safe to come to the inner harbor,and we should not say the word black teen thugs.and because of this mayors in action, its going to get worst.people if you don't have some form of selfdefense when your down town,your going to be the next victim
http://innerharborviolencenightmaresonlightstreet.renthandy.com/

The American Indian Holocaust, known as the “500 year war” and the “World’s Longest Holocaust In The History Of Mankind And Loss Of Human Lives.”
GENOCIDE AND DENYING IT: WHY WE ARE NOT TAUGHT THAT THE NATIVES OF THE UNITED STATES AND CANADA WERE EXTERMINATED
Death Toll: 95,000,000 to 114,000,000
Can only wonder which mobs pulled these stunts.... we all have it pretty easy...we should all just take care of ourselves....don't need the gov taking care of things that they are not good at.....like most things..

Lily
This state loves to tax us a law us to death. I think they could figure out some type of crime and punishment (FINE) to levy on a parent for not keeping their child under control. I don’t care if your Richie Rich’s parents or Poor dunk Paul parents everyone needs to be in control of their kids.

Again Law makers can change laws, welfare and all entitlement programs need to reformed. It will take a lot of work but come on let’s look at the savings if something like this would be in place. How do you figure if you collect X amount now of state money and you get a JOB and make more then what the state was giving you what are you losing? Outside of FREE MONEY from the tax payers. Come on now generation after generation after generation people on welfare WHY? BECAUSE THEY ARE LAZY PERIOD….

Unemployment is something totally different but just as crocked as well. People continue to submit because they don’t want to work for anything less then they made in the past….

Finally, I guess My wife and I are prodigies, we have nothing more than a high school diploma from Dundalk high before the animals moved into Dundalk and both make over the $60,000 mark a year. I called hard work and wanting something better for myself and my family anything else is an excuse.

I don't think I can have a reasonable discussion with someone who refers to other human beings as "animals"

Needless to say we do not agree.

Your right maybe calling them animals might have just infuriated the animal kingdom. How do you refer to these people the criminals, tugs, low lives, lazy, good for nothing people? Some people must rather be cage up like an animal instead of dealing with society.

Really answer my questions or are you too liberal for a real discussion.

I prefer to refer to all human beings as people made in the image and likeness of God and therefore worthy of a certain dignity even if their behavior does not reflect it.

Your way hasn't worked in how many years? The ole saying "You can lead them to water but you can't make them drink".

Watch this series made by REAL, INNER CITY BLACK YOUTH THUGS...

http://www.youtube.com/verify_age?next_url=/watch%3Fv%3D3w-ihQTPQsU

Than tell me that "black youth, racially motivated, mobs hell bent on terrorism" is a lie!!!!!!!!!

Its called "Hood Life" made in Palm Beach, FL by admitted inner city black youth thugs. It shows racially selected and motivated beatings of innocent white males and condones violence, guns, drug dealing, and even the desire to NOT be educated but follow you path!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The video series I posted above is 100% what we are saying and posted and made by 100% black inner city youth thugs. They admit to how their culture is hell bent on racism, murder, crime and flash mobs directed at white people. This type of media is spreading fast threw society and these racist black flash mobs are the "rage" for the past few years now!

Stop making excuses!

I think you don't know what racism is or why you are in fact a racist. It's racism because when you see a group of people doing something negative and you decide to associate those actions with the person's race you are saying something.

You are saying that black youth form mobs and hurt people. The truth is that this is not the case. Most black youth do not form mobs and hurt people any more than white youth or any other race across the globe.

What we are seeing is the result of the very lowest poverty group. That group of people have come to the point where their exclusion from the culture has led to an anti culture.

It's not fair to identify them by race because any race faced with the same degree of poverty and oppression would be at risk for the same behavior. I know and live around many black people. My family is white. I've never had a problem with black youth. I'm quite impressed by many of them in fact. They excel in spite of great adversity.

You want people to think that these people engaging in criminal behavior is an accurate representation of how most black youth are. How do you think the many black honor students feel when they hear you talking about "black youth"? You might say oh but they are the exception. NO, these mobs are the exception and not exclusive to black people. I hope they don't decide all white people are racist.

It's a huge problem that people can engage in this type of racism and not even know it's racism.

Ronn, your 100% right! If the liberals don't like what someone says about blacks, it's racism. The race card, don't leave home without it!

Lily. Thank you thank you! Reverse what you said... that white person would be deemed a racist! AND that is the issue WE are speaking of! If whites made a video of beating black people and holding guns and shooting off automatic weapons and screaming anti- law, government agenda... they would be put in jail tomorrow by the FBI! Of courze ghere are amazing blavk children, but that is not the issue here. WE are talking about those admitted thugs that are video taping and organizing in mobs to conduct terrorism. Can you differenciate between the Good And Bad??? Apparently not!
The problem here is that you are ignoring the facts, the crimes, the racism, the accepted thug life of these black youth! No, not All Black youth, but those who are commiting these serious crimes!
Please wake up!

I have no problem saying that what these children are doing is wrong and needs to be stopped. What I think is wrong is the tendency of some to shout from the top of every mountain "see, look it's BLACK kids doing this. We need to do something about the BLACK kids. The BLACK kids are the problem. Where are their BLACK parents. What are we going to do about all these BLACK people"

How is it you don't see that this is racist?

Read this article and see if maybe you are capable of some sort of understanding?
http://www.afro.com/sections/opinion/story.htm?storyid=75180

And for the record... I'm not a liberal. I'm not anything. I'm unaffiliated and I make up my mind for myself about every single detail of anything in politics or anything else for that matter.

Other Tim

The answer to your question has to do with oppression. When something positive happens race is attached because it is encouraging for those living under the oppressive nature of racism. When race is attached to something negative in the way it is being attached to the youth mobs then that type of negativity is racism, it is oppression. One fights oppression. The other is oppression.

Living in a world where you are perpetually made to feel by anyone not in your classification that you are worthless and doomed to fail because all your people are like that... this is oppression and every person who embraces the oppressive mantra and spreads it is spreading poison.

Do you think the children of the oppressed won't grow up to be exactly what the oppressor's say they are when the oppressors are everywhere in authority? This is why the positive is proclaimed so loudly while the negative is dealt with separate from the issue of race. Because the negative doesn't say anything about the race but the posative says "HEY you can do it... this Black person did. They were oppressed and they made it"

Ron,

When there were primarily white youth mobs in Canton and Fells Point no one said "white youth mobs" in fact they didn't say much of anything at all.

Lily - I see your point but the "oppression" argument is getting old. Looking at a video and accurately describing what is going on is not oppression and it's not racist. I haven't read any post that project behavior in the videos or in the news on African American culture as a whole. You have made that leap and that is offensive. The only way to change this behavior is to hold those responsible accountable. This includes the kids and possibly their parents/guardians. At some point we need to stop making excuses . If you choose todo drugs, drop out of school, hang out with low life's and don't get a job that's not oppression - that's bad choices. And when you are in that situation and choose to impregnate someone or become pregnant, that keeps the cycle rolling. Pull the plug on food stamps, unemployment, free cell phones and other perks for being irresponsible and eventually the cycle will break. Until then - forget the semantics and PC languange - it's not helping anyone.

Oppression is just an excuse, as long as people use that word the oppressed feels entitled.

The oppressed don't feel entitled. They feel oppressed by people who think oppression doesn't exist. They don't have any other option but to take the entitlement for various reasons most of the time. Believe me if they had an option they would take it. Again we are talking about poverty here not race. Most of the characteristics you are citing are related to poverty... not race.

If you already "know" something bad happening in Baltimore had to be black people and couldn't have been white people then the racist arguments have won your brain and your prejudice is complete. Lord have mercy.

It means the knowledge that thousands of black kids were not doing anything wrong isn't what formed your stereotype. It was the handful that were doing something wrong.

Saying oppression is just an excuse is like saying I can beat you from the infancy with a stick because it will make you stronger and then ridiculing you because you are a cripple who can't work and saying that it's your own fault you were not strong enough to keep me from beating you. It's idiotic.

"If you choose todo drugs, drop out of school, hang out with low life's and don't get a job that's not oppression - that's bad choices."

If you are born to parents in poverty who live in poverty - what was your choice?

If the neighborhood school you were sent to failed to educate - what was your choice?

If both your parents were uninvolved in your upbringing because they were trying to survive poverty and you were not socialized properly - what was your choice?

If you knew nothing about how the rest of the world world works except the small corner of it that you were raised in - what was your choice?

If you felt alone by all of this and you had friends at school all being raised the same way because of socioeconomic clustering and the lack of affordable housing - what was you choice?

I everyone was scared of you and wouldn't talk to you because you were born into all these things - what was your choice?

If you left the area you grew up in but couldn't change the color of your skin and everyone judged you still by it and assumed your upbringing because of it - what was your choice?

If you never grew up like this at all, and happened to be treated like you did because of the color of your skin - what was your choice?

If you figured all this out - how pissed would you be?

This is oppression. People don't choose to be oppressed. Oppression takes their option to choose away. They are backed into a corner from birth. No one wants them and no one cares.

good questions lily. but they are only only questions. tell us some facts. questions are so normally biased to one position for a programed response.

I don't know how many black people living in the city would say there were oppressed.

Poverty all by itself is oppressive. Not because it's necessarily caused by anyone. It just is oppressive. When racism is piled on top of poverty that makes it almost impossible to escape.

Education is the key to social mobility. The poor are held back in education by so many things. Imagine you are a kid and you go to school hungry because your mom banks on the school to feed you so she can pay 90% of her income in rent. Since she pays 90% of her income in rent she needs to sell her food stamp benefit at 50 cents on the dollar to have money for enough bus fair to even get back and forth from work. Not to mention the utilities etc. Eventually something happens, a doctor visit or whatever that means she can't pay the rent or utilities. So you move about every six months or so and keep switching schools as a result. Plus you are home alone because welfare to work requires your single mom to work and her job makes enough that she doesn't qualify for a daycare voucher. You're really scared because you are too young to be home alone so you go next door and stay there with the dealers. At least they will feed you if you deliver a package for them. But you don't tell your mom because she would kill you. Where is your homework?

Sounds like a sad movie - schools provide free breakfast and lunch. Who is piling on the racism to the kids - the teachs at school? City schools have federally funded after school programs. Does her job have health care - who's fault is that? Schools provide very inexpensive insurance to cover kids. And guess what - if it's that bad than DSS should get that kid out of there and give them a chance in a foster home. Again - no excuses.

By the way - I'm one big bill away from the "poor house" myself and so are all of my non-oppressed middle class friends. We don't get independence cards, free cell phones, free lunch, free breakfast, free child care, rent control, or subsidized utilities. We also don't get our nails done, hair done, wear designer clothing or wear name brand shoes. We get up early, make breakfast for our kids, get them out of bed, make sure they go to school, attend teacher confences, check homework, cook dinner, go to a second job, ......... Get the picture.

I do get the picture. My only point is that somewhere along the line someone taught you to do that. At what age is a child responsible for the whole of their future? If you think city schools are so great why are they all failing to make adequate yearly progress. Why are all the kids failing. The schools in poor districts don't provide the social network you think they do. If they did you wouldn't mind sending your kids there. These severely poverty stricken kids live in a whole different world than you can even perceive. They were impoverished from birth if they do make it out it's because someone outside their world helped them get out. Why can't you be that person? Why can't you do something the situation so it doesn't get so out of control that poverty stricken youth become the type of people who would do these things? Why can't you go volunteer in a Baltimore city school one day a month for a couple of hours and learn for yourself how to love beyond those you "like"? Why should anyone have to explain any of this to you?

Lily. I am being very serious when I say; "I love your passion for the impoverishment of certain individuals in the city." We need more people like yourself to try to make a difference. You would be shocked if you knew about me and my past and where I grew up and my family and where I am today via trying everything to improve my life.

I however, feel you speak for a smaller percentage of the inner city society. I am not adept to give numbers towards this, but I do the know the numbers when it comes to crimes in the city. (That within itself does make one say, "Why do I know the crime based stats, but not the real impoverishment based stats. I will give you that).

Yet, the topic here is not talking about a specific socio-economic portion of the inner city as you keep speaking about. The topic is discussing a repeated crime wave that is not a "one time event"; it has occurred over and over and over for 6 years now. Many have died or have become serious victims! The pattern and facts SHOW/ PROVE that the greatest majority of the time it is "Young Black Individuals" committing these crimes. Why do you have an issue with telling it as it is?

Facts are facts. Stats are stats. If we observe a pattern of violence and other criminal activity; are we to ignore the obvious statistical variables?

Actually DSS does remove kids. Just yanked three kids in my school out of a horrible situation. If mom teacher her kid not to trust than again, that's part of the problem. Why is she oppressing hr own kid? 80 hours - I doubt it besides you just said her jobs would only give her 29 hours?? Walmart has great benefits by the way and does a great job working around schedules. Actually the teachers don't have any bias - they love working with challenging kids and are there by choice. They could care less about AYP - they love kids and pour their heart out. They show the kids more love than any other adults in their life. You are clueless!!

I don't know every single statistic and I grew up in New York state so forgive me if I don't know your MD equivalent to what we call a school district. I don't have a problem with saying the black people are disproportionately affected by poverty and that's why it looks to some people like it's a causality and not a correlation.

I do get everything you are saying. Believe it or not I was raised Republican so I used to think the way you do. People have to learn all that.

The topic here is not the crime. It's why it has to be hammered what race the people were who did it. At least that's what I'm talking about. We can all agree the crime has to stop and people need to be held accountable whoever they are and I wish kids could just be taken from some of their parents but that's never going to happen.

I'm not a Lay-Z-Boy lawyer. I was one of those kids. Now I live a middle class life just like you do. But I didn't do it by myself. Without help I would have had no choices at all.

I guess my other point is also, can you imagine a world where everyone volunteered a few hours of their time in a way that would help an impoverished kid. Seriously. Go be a CASA volunteer. There are tens of thousands of kids in the system who need it and it takes 15 hours a month. Or any other thing that would help. But everyone doesn't. Most people don't and so that is why we have a crime problem. It's the great tragedy of the commons that we don't care enough to put our time where our mouth is. We think money solves the problems. Relationship solves the problems.

Lily. You have called those of us applying our free-speech; "racists". That my friend is powerful, corrupt and in fact very demeaning. You know nothing about us and our pasts! Yet, the powers that be repeatedly call anyone white a racist if they in anyway denounce black behavior or issues. You have fallen or have adopted that pattern.

Here you go. Here are some random numbers for you to consider.
http://www.radford.edu/~junnever/bw.htm

I'm only looking at what you are saying here and it sounds pretty racist to me. I think the bigger problem is that both camps define what racism is differently such that both groups use the same word but mean something very different by it. People offended and hurt by racism would look at what you wrote here and think you were a racist... mostly by ignorance but a racist just the same.

Maybe you should take personal responsibility for the lack of complete clarity in your "free speech". **good natured sarcasm**

I'll take that drink only on the promise that you keep a more open mind.

Bedtime for Bonzo. I have an honest job to report to in the AM. Lets see what crap I deal with tomorrow. I am sure it will be more dam white folk running amuck in the city. Normally is.

"black behavior" is a myth. There is nothing that is "black behavior". The problem is that if you take all the people in poverty most of them are going to be black because black people are disproportionately affected by poverty.

However that's not the vast majority of black people. Look closely at those numbers in that link. Only 9% of whites are in poverty compared to 27% of black people. Racism is when you look at the behavior of that 27% and use it to define the whole race. So if a group of poor people are doing something that gets on video it doesn't matter what it is they are doing they are going to be mostly black people doing it because of the make up of the people in poverty not because of the make up the black race. It doesn't make it "black behavior".

Does any of that make sense?

Here you go this is also revealing if you want the truth about something.
http://usfoodpolicy.blogspot.com/2009/12/food-stamp-participation-by-race-and.html

Again oppression is an excuse… Did Dr Ben Carson let oppression beat him down? What about these people Oprah, Booker T Washington, Elvis, Paul Mitchell, Li Ka-shing, and Herman Cain. Yes I did add diversity to the list. This small list are people that were oppressed that saw the big picture and wanted more out of life then handouts.

Well Able Barker I could continue to list additional names if you like me too, naming a few was making a point that people can achieve anything they want, it’s up to each individual to succeed or fail.

What have I achieved let’s see I’m working in a fulfilling career in public safety putting my life on the line daily, I have donated my time to Rec Councils for the past 19 years. I volunteered in the past for different organizations. Really can’t say I’m lazy, when I wasn’t making the money I do now I worked upwards to 80 hours a week to provide for my family so they could have the best of everything.

Now is that good enough for you? Not that I have to prove anything to you......

I don't care how "oppressed" anybody is. If they commit crimes, they are criminals. If they are black, they are black.

oppression exists ,but not so much that its a excuse to be a criminal. here,s the problem you have a lot of black leaders who are ashamed of how there people are behaving,and instead of addressing that behavior they blame white folks for all there ills,and catch a attitude when you say black teens are the problem.right now they are the problem.every race has people who are thugs,but in Baltimore city its the black teens. until our leaders agree with those who see the problem,they will never be able to solve the problem
http://innerharborviolencenightmaresonlightstreet.renthandy.com/

how can you see black teens steal,see black teens assault,lock up black teens that kill and get offended when someone white sees the same thing and tells you about it.this is the mayors attitude. that's the problem with city officials,instead of solving the problem they lie and say its not happening

Parkvillehoney

11:42 am on Friday, June 15, 2012

I bet if you look into the backgrounds of the majority of the black teen "criminals" they are not living hand to mouth. They feel they are "entitled" to what normal people work for. Instead of finding a job and working their way up to middle class, they would rather steal to get it NOW. Look at the ATF raid in Hampden on Thursday, 06/15/20112. All the persons involved were black! One of the persons didn't think nothing of trying to run down 2 police officers. I am sick and tired of watching the 11PM news and seeing one black person after another involved in crime. STOP trying to make excuses for criminals!!! You do the crime, you do the time. END of story.